Backyard Designs

My wife and I have been having a study with some Jehovah’s Witnesses (two studies now). We are both avid Church goers but figured it couldn’t hurt to have another Bible study and learn more about other Christian doctrines.

Since they knew we were avid Christians they just let us pick a topic in their book “What Does the Bible Really Teach?” We looked at the Table of Contents and picked “Where are the Dead?” From there it was a rather ‘interesting’ study that we have agreed to continue but we are at a loss as to what we should do. No matter what verses we show them that disagree with their beliefs causes them to quickly try to discredit the verse saying that we’re either reading to much into it or that we simply don’t understand it fully.

They brought up Ecclesiastest 9:5 (For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.) and Genesis 2:16-17 (And the LORD God commanded the man, “You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.”). They said that the dead are aware of nothing, so we can’t be in Heaven or hell because the dead aren’t aware and can’t do anything, and that once man (Adam) ate of the tree of knowledge he would surely die and become dust.

So we mentioned that we believed the death He spoke of was a spiritual death and though our body returns to dust our soul continues on. We brought up Isaiah 14:9-11 (9 The grave below is all astir to meet you at your coming; it rouses the spirits of the departed to greet you, all those who were leaders in the world; it makes them rise from their thrones, all those who were kings over the nations. They will all respond, they will say to you, “You also have become weak, as we are; you have become like us.” All your pomp has been brought down to the grave, along with the noise of your harps; maggots are spread out beneath you and worms cover you.) and 1 Peter 3:18-20 (For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water…).

We thought it was pretty cut and dry and we even had other verses ready to do; they simply told us that we were, again, reading to much into this and then brought up something about our body is made up of nerves that allows us to feel and if our body is returning to dust and we are only spirits so how can we feel anything? I mentioned that God makes everything possible and could design our souls to act without our body being able to feel and reason. After that they asked if we had noticed that most Bible’s don’t use the name of God, Jehovah, like it was used in original Greek/Hebrew Bibles and they never answered our questions after they quickly changed the topic. Each time we bring up verses like this, ones they can’t easily twist to their beliefs, they instantly find a subtle way to change the subject and never answer our questions.

How should I approach them? Any tips for dealing with them? Is it worth it? I’ve been told that they will hold to what the Watch Tower has taught them no matter how much the Bible contradicts them and there is nothing I can do. As a Christian I’m taught to spread the Word of God, but if it won’t amount anything should I give up?

Thanks in Advance!

Just let’s recap what Christianity does for mankind. Mostly promoting lies:
-intelligent design.
-Creationism, Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden.
-Noah and the ark.
-Moses.
-Jesus.
-The Earth as the fixed center of the universe.
-The concept of sin attached to natural phenomena: homosexuality as a sin.
Also making people feel guilty, sad, for imaginary causes, or like Nietzsche puts it “under Christianity neither morality nor religion has any point of contact with actuality. It offers purely imaginary causes (”God” “soul,” “ego,” “spirit,” “free will”−−or even “unfree”), and purely imaginary effects (”sin” “salvation” “grace,” “punishment,” “forgiveness of sins”). Intercourse between imaginary beings (”God,” “spirits,” “souls”); an imaginary natural history (anthropocentric; a total denial of the concept of natural causes); an imaginary psychology (misunderstandings of self, misinterpretations of agreeable or disagreeable general feelings−−for example, of the states of the nervous sympathicus with the help of the sign−language of religio−ethical balderdash−−, “repentance,” “pangs of conscience,” “temptation by the devil,” “the presence of God”); an imaginary teleology (the “kingdom of God,” “the last judgment,” “eternal life”).−−This purely fictitious world, greatly to its disadvantage, is to be differentiated from the world of dreams; the later at least reflects reality, whereas the former falsifies it, cheapens it and denies it. Once the concept of “nature” had been opposed to the concept of “God,” the word “natural” necessarily took on the meaning of “abominable”−−the whole of that fictitious world has its
sources in hatred of the natural.”– F.Nietzsche.

Seriously everytime I hear the story of Eve and the garden of eden I always hear about how free will failed and how god wasn’t involved however who designed free will? A good, flawless god, right? Huh? So wait how did the flaws develope if a good god created free will? That makes no sense! Its like someone who makes pottery somehow makes a car. How does that happen? I mean how is it possible for a good, flawless god to somehow design something that doesn’t work and is completely evil? Someone else had to have had a hand in the creation process which will prove that god is not omnipotent. What do you think? So when people say to me, “oh you! Don’t you blame god.” well who else am I supposed to blame? Satan? Come on he too was created by the good god and for some reason he turned out to be filled with flaw and completely evil. The good god created his nemisis. Every angel was created by god and 2/3 of his creation turned against him. How? He personally developed these people. How do these people turn out evil when they are designed by a good god? How does free will fail if it is designed by a flawless and good god. This doesn’t make any sense. Oh and why is there evil and sin within the fruit when it was created by a god that frowns upon sins?

Why did God put the snake or the tree in the garden…surely he could have designed it better so there was no fall and so that even with free will we would not mess up. Especially as he is meant to be able to see the future so he should have been able to design the world and the garden so no fall would occur.